Comments on: Obama for Minister of the Left http://www.froginawell.net/china/2008/02/obama-for-minister-of-the-left/ The China History Group Blog Mon, 15 Mar 2010 02:40:25 -0700 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.1 hourly 1 By: Frog in a Well - The Korea History Group Blog http://www.froginawell.net/china/2008/02/obama-for-minister-of-the-left/comment-page-1/#comment-89694 Frog in a Well - The Korea History Group Blog Fri, 15 Feb 2008 12:03:46 +0000 http://www.froginawell.net/china/2008/02/obama-for-minister-of-the-left/#comment-89694 [...] Our own Alan Baumler suggests that an 11th century poem by Shao Yung can help us understand why many people who may have little [...] [...] Our own Alan Baumler suggests that an 11th century poem by Shao Yung can help us understand why many people who may have little [...]

]]> By: Alan Baumler http://www.froginawell.net/china/2008/02/obama-for-minister-of-the-left/comment-page-1/#comment-87084 Alan Baumler Mon, 04 Feb 2008 12:03:25 +0000 http://www.froginawell.net/china/2008/02/obama-for-minister-of-the-left/#comment-87084 Jeremiah, The Taiwan example is interesting, and I think it points to one of the problems of democracy in Chinese political culture. Most Taiwan politicians are not that impressive to me. Lee Teng-hui is the only one I can think of that anybody could see as a moral figure of any sort. I think that is sort of to be expected. It is hard to see how you could square a Confucian-flavored moral politics with political conflict. If my candidate is Christ what does that make yours? This of course is the problem of faction in Chinese politics that Ouyang Xiu and others wrote about. If the emperor's government is a moral force how can it have factions and divisions? One of the things that makes democracy is an idea of loyal dissent, which Ouyang at least really struggled with. Jeremiah,
The Taiwan example is interesting, and I think it points to one of the problems of democracy in Chinese political culture. Most Taiwan politicians are not that impressive to me. Lee Teng-hui is the only one I can think of that anybody could see as a moral figure of any sort. I think that is sort of to be expected. It is hard to see how you could square a Confucian-flavored moral politics with political conflict. If my candidate is Christ what does that make yours?
This of course is the problem of faction in Chinese politics that Ouyang Xiu and others wrote about. If the emperor’s government is a moral force how can it have factions and divisions? One of the things that makes democracy is an idea of loyal dissent, which Ouyang at least really struggled with.

]]> By: Jeremiah http://www.froginawell.net/china/2008/02/obama-for-minister-of-the-left/comment-page-1/#comment-87072 Jeremiah Mon, 04 Feb 2008 10:28:28 +0000 http://www.froginawell.net/china/2008/02/obama-for-minister-of-the-left/#comment-87072 I think Alan's suggestion that democracy in China would look quite different raises some really fascinating questions. I'm not as up on my contemporary Taiwan politics as perhaps I should be, but wouldn't Taiwan provide a possible 'case study' here? I'm just throwing it out there, and seeing if it sticks. Anyone have some thoughts on the issue? By the way, great post. I think Alan’s suggestion that democracy in China would look quite different raises some really fascinating questions. I’m not as up on my contemporary Taiwan politics as perhaps I should be, but wouldn’t Taiwan provide a possible ‘case study’ here? I’m just throwing it out there, and seeing if it sticks. Anyone have some thoughts on the issue?

By the way, great post.

]]> By: C. W. Hayford http://www.froginawell.net/china/2008/02/obama-for-minister-of-the-left/comment-page-1/#comment-86998 C. W. Hayford Mon, 04 Feb 2008 03:47:17 +0000 http://www.froginawell.net/china/2008/02/obama-for-minister-of-the-left/#comment-86998 Alan's comment that democracy in China will be very different is appropos of Ian Buruma's characteristically pointed column,"Culture is No Excuse for China Denying It's People Democracy" in the Guardian Sunday Feb 3 http://observer.guardian.co.uk/print/0,,332351970-102273,00.html Buruma has some familiar things to say, but says them cogently. Alan’s comment that democracy in China will be very different is appropos of Ian Buruma’s characteristically pointed column,”Culture is No Excuse for China Denying It’s People Democracy” in the Guardian Sunday Feb 3 http://observer.guardian.co.uk/print/0,,332351970-102273,00.html

Buruma has some familiar things to say, but says them cogently.

]]> By: Alex K http://www.froginawell.net/china/2008/02/obama-for-minister-of-the-left/comment-page-1/#comment-86979 Alex K Mon, 04 Feb 2008 02:14:21 +0000 http://www.froginawell.net/china/2008/02/obama-for-minister-of-the-left/#comment-86979 Barack Obama for a new America! We love him in NYC. We are sick and tired of the Bush and Clinton dynasties, and we desperately want the USA to be a source of hope and generosity for the rest of the world (not war criminals and marauders). Change is coming in 2008. YES WE CAN!!! ps. Andrew Sullivan sent me : ) Barack Obama for a new America! We love him in NYC. We are sick and tired of the Bush and Clinton dynasties, and we desperately want the USA to be a source of hope and generosity for the rest of the world (not war criminals and marauders). Change is coming in 2008. YES WE CAN!!! ps. Andrew Sullivan sent me : )

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