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	<title>Comments on: RG242: Foreigners in North Korea</title>
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	<link>http://www.froginawell.net/korea/2007/04/rg242-foreigners-in-north-korea/</link>
	<description>The Korea History Group Blog</description>
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		<title>By: Asian History Carnival #14 (Straight Outta Beijing&#8230;)</title>
		<link>http://www.froginawell.net/korea/2007/04/rg242-foreigners-in-north-korea/comment-page-1/#comment-49626</link>
		<dc:creator>Asian History Carnival #14 (Straight Outta Beijing&#8230;)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Jan 2008 00:09:47 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>[...] matter of principle, upload to the Internet whatever of interest he or she finds.&#8221; (Konrad is working the archives overtime and is always adding more good stuff to the Frog in a Well [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] matter of principle, upload to the Internet whatever of interest he or she finds.&#8221; (Konrad is working the archives overtime and is always adding more good stuff to the Frog in a Well [...]</p>
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		<title>By: K. M. Lawson</title>
		<link>http://www.froginawell.net/korea/2007/04/rg242-foreigners-in-north-korea/comment-page-1/#comment-18854</link>
		<dc:creator>K. M. Lawson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Apr 2007 23:05:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.froginawell.net/korea/2007/04/rg242-foreigners-in-north-korea/#comment-18854</guid>
		<description>Thanks Owen.  You are right, Hyesan is not a good place to look for a diverse migrant population.  It is the only one of these document packs I looked at, however, so I&#039;m not really sure what kind of selection there are in the others.  The other ones I listed at the bottom come from all over North Korea, including north and south Hamgyŏng, north and south P&#039;yŏngan, northern Hwanghae, P&#039;yŏngyang city etc.

You ask an interesting question about copying categories etc.  I don&#039;t know about the censor records but I have been snapping pictures of a few examples where the documents use the exact same stationary as the colonial period, complete with hiragana, years labeled &quot;Showa,&quot; and with the Japanese administrative institutional names.  More common, however, is the frequent use of the back of Japanese stationary or pages ripped out of books for forms.  There seems to have been a major shortage of paper since the official documents of the period (often within a single package of identical forms) come from a hodgepodge of sources.  

The most commonly Japanese form used, however, was the telegraph form, which is found throughout RG242.  

It is a separate question however if the forms were changed slightly while the categories of the colonizer remained the same.  I don&#039;t have much to compare with since I&#039;m not familiar with the colonial forms/categories.  I can say, however, that there is a Soviet influence everywhere.  Even as early as 1946-7 I&#039;m seeing lots of translated Soviet textbooks on legal procedures, and lots of handwritten student notebooks on how to record things.

The lists of villagers also use very familiar &quot;landowner, rich, middle, poor&quot; peasant distinctions etc., and I might try to post some images of these forms that I came across. Party and religion is on almost every form, at least for the first two years of the postwar.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Owen.  You are right, Hyesan is not a good place to look for a diverse migrant population.  It is the only one of these document packs I looked at, however, so I&#8217;m not really sure what kind of selection there are in the others.  The other ones I listed at the bottom come from all over North Korea, including north and south Hamgyŏng, north and south P&#8217;yŏngan, northern Hwanghae, P&#8217;yŏngyang city etc.</p>
<p>You ask an interesting question about copying categories etc.  I don&#8217;t know about the censor records but I have been snapping pictures of a few examples where the documents use the exact same stationary as the colonial period, complete with hiragana, years labeled &#8220;Showa,&#8221; and with the Japanese administrative institutional names.  More common, however, is the frequent use of the back of Japanese stationary or pages ripped out of books for forms.  There seems to have been a major shortage of paper since the official documents of the period (often within a single package of identical forms) come from a hodgepodge of sources.  </p>
<p>The most commonly Japanese form used, however, was the telegraph form, which is found throughout RG242.  </p>
<p>It is a separate question however if the forms were changed slightly while the categories of the colonizer remained the same.  I don&#8217;t have much to compare with since I&#8217;m not familiar with the colonial forms/categories.  I can say, however, that there is a Soviet influence everywhere.  Even as early as 1946-7 I&#8217;m seeing lots of translated Soviet textbooks on legal procedures, and lots of handwritten student notebooks on how to record things.</p>
<p>The lists of villagers also use very familiar &#8220;landowner, rich, middle, poor&#8221; peasant distinctions etc., and I might try to post some images of these forms that I came across. Party and religion is on almost every form, at least for the first two years of the postwar.</p>
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		<title>By: Owen</title>
		<link>http://www.froginawell.net/korea/2007/04/rg242-foreigners-in-north-korea/comment-page-1/#comment-18755</link>
		<dc:creator>Owen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Apr 2007 10:08:11 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Really fascinating stuff Konrad. Did you notice that all these records come from &lt;a href=&quot;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyesan&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Hyesan&lt;/a&gt; Township in Hamgyŏngnamdo (now Ryanggang Province)? Since this is right on the Chinese border it would stand to reason that there would be Chinese living there and presumably it would not be representative of the counties of &#039;Pukchosŏn&#039; in general.

From a different angle, one approach that would be interesting would be to compare the sort of information recorded in these documents with equivalent or similar documents from the colonial period. I&#039;d be interested to know how much the nascent North Korean state simply took on the bureaucratic/administrative practices of the Japanese colonial state, even perhaps down to copying their census forms. Conversely, how much did they change the categories of information that they recorded due to their different concerns? For example, I notice in the form you have reproduced above that they record the monetary wealth of the foreigner in question and their membership of any party or &#039;social group&#039; (which in this case is recorded as Hwagyo - overseas Chinese).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Really fascinating stuff Konrad. Did you notice that all these records come from <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyesan" rel="nofollow">Hyesan</a> Township in Hamgyŏngnamdo (now Ryanggang Province)? Since this is right on the Chinese border it would stand to reason that there would be Chinese living there and presumably it would not be representative of the counties of &#8216;Pukchosŏn&#8217; in general.</p>
<p>From a different angle, one approach that would be interesting would be to compare the sort of information recorded in these documents with equivalent or similar documents from the colonial period. I&#8217;d be interested to know how much the nascent North Korean state simply took on the bureaucratic/administrative practices of the Japanese colonial state, even perhaps down to copying their census forms. Conversely, how much did they change the categories of information that they recorded due to their different concerns? For example, I notice in the form you have reproduced above that they record the monetary wealth of the foreigner in question and their membership of any party or &#8216;social group&#8217; (which in this case is recorded as Hwagyo &#8211; overseas Chinese).</p>
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